Discussion:
"Aizu-Bandai-San"
(too old to reply)
B. Ito
2004-07-10 18:54:07 UTC
Permalink
I posted my English translations of a well-known Japanese
min-you, "Yosakoi Bushi" on July 7th.

Another min-you about which I mentioned then there is
"Aizu-Bandai-San." It took me some time to find a good
MIDI for my karaoke and much more time for fixing my
translations to meet the MIDI which is specially arranged.

My English translations and vocal sample are in the URL below:

http://bito2.tsukaeru.jp/Aizubandaisan.htm


$B!!!!!!(B $B!!!!!!(BAizu-Badai-San No. 317
$B!!!!2qDEHXDt;3(B
$B!!!!!!!!!!!!!!J!Eg8)L1MX(B Fukushima-Ken Min-You
(1)
$B%(%$!<%d!<(B
Ei ya-

$B2qDEHXDt;3!J$"$$$E$P$s$@$$$5$s!K$O!!Ju$N;3$h(B
Aizu-Bandai-San wa takara no yama yo

$B:{$K2+6b!J$3$,$M!K$,!!%(!<$^$?(B $B$J$j$5$,$k(B
Sasa ni kogane ga e- mata nari-sagaru

$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa


Ei-Ya___.
Aizu-Badai-San i_s / a_ trea_su_re mo_un_tain__.
You$B!G(Bll see the_ bamboo lea_ves / be_ari___ng re_a_l go_ld coi__ns.
( Choisa___ choisa )


(2)
$B%(%$!<%d!<(B
Ei ya-

$B$3$H$7$cK-G/!J$[$&$M$s!K!!Jf!J$[!K$KJf$,:i$$$F(B
Kotosha hounen ho ni ho ga saite

$BF;$N>.Ap!J$3$0$5!K$b!!%(!<$^$?(B $BJF$,$J$k(B
Michi no kogusa mo e- mata kome ga naru

$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa


Ei-Ya___.
This year_ we$B!G(Bll enjo_y / a_ goo_d har_ve_st o_f ri_ce.
You$B!G(Bll see the_ road-side grasses /
be_ari___ng hea_vy__ bunches of
ri_ce.
( Choisa___ choisa )



$B>.86>1=u!J$*$O$i$7$g$&$9$1$5$s!K$5$s(B $B$J$s$G?H>e!J$7$s$7$g$&!K$D$V$7$?(B
Ohara Shousuke San nande shinshou tsubushita

$BD+?2!J$"$5$M!K!!D+<r!!D+Er!J$"$5$f!K$,Bg9%$-$G(B
Asa-ne asa-zake asa-yu ga dai-suki de

$B$=$l$G?H>e$D$V$7$?(B
Sore de shinshou tsubushita

$B$b$C$H$b$@!!$b$C$H$b$@(B
Mottomo da mottomo da


Ohara Shoosuke-san, why has he lo_st his fortune ?
He was fond of / sleeping la_te (in the morning), /
morning sake a_nd morning ba_th.
That$B!G(Bs why he wen_t into bankruptcy.
That$B!G(Bs rea_sonable, quite reasonable, isn$B!G(Bt it ?


2004. 7. 7, 9, 11 Translated by: B. Ito
------------------------------------------------------------
B. Ito ***@wonder.ocn.ne.jp$B!!(B
$BF|K\L>6J!&1Q8l%t%!!<%8%g%s!"A46J#3(B1$B#0?t6J(B
HP 1: http://www8.ocn.ne.jp/~bito/
MUZIE$BEPO?!'(Bhttp://www.muzie.co.jp/cgi-bin/artist.cgi?id=a011096
Bart Mathias
2004-07-11 02:59:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by B. Ito
...
Another min-you about which I mentioned then there is
"Aizu-Bandai-San." ...
One of the first $BL1MX(B I learned and still a favorite.
Post by B. Ito
Aizu-Bandai-San wa takara no yama yo
$B:{$K2+6b!J$3$,$M!K$,!!%(!<$^$?(B $B$J$j$5$,$k(B
Sasa ni kogane ga e- mata nari-sagaru
$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa
Ei-Ya___.
Aizu-Badai-San i_s / a_ trea_su_re mo_un_tain__.
You$B!G(Bll see the_ bamboo lea_ves / be_ari___ng re_a_l go_ld coi__ns.
( Choisa___ choisa )
People might think there's bamboo involved. Would "bamboo grass" work
as well as "bamboo leaves"? And "weighed down with" fits my mental
picture better than "bearing real."
Post by B. Ito
(2)
$B%(%$!<%d!<(B
Ei ya-
$B$3$H$7$cK-G/!J$[$&$M$s!K!!Jf!J$[!K$KJf$,:i$$$F(B
Kotosha hounen ho ni ho ga saite
$BF;$N>.Ap!J$3$0$5!K$b!!%(!<$^$?(B $BJF$,$J$k(B
Michi no kogusa mo e- mata kome ga naru
I don't seem to have learnt this verse. My second one goes something
like $B$$$J$+(B($B!)(B)$B$6$+$G$b!"EP$l$P2<$k(B. Then somebody's name, maybe (wow,
it must be a long time since I've tried to sing this one, $B6a=j$N<jA0$r9M(B
$B$($F$M(B) before the $B%(!<$^$?(B, the $BDa%1>k(B(sp?).
Post by B. Ito
$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa
...
$B>.86>1=u!J$*$O$i$7$g$&$9$1$5$s!K$5$s(B $B$J$s$G?H>e!J$7$s$7$g$&!K$D$V$7$?(B
Ohara Shousuke San nande shinshou tsubushita
$BD+?2!J$"$5$M!K!!D+<r!!D+Er!J$"$5$f!K$,Bg9%$-$G(B
Asa-ne asa-zake asa-yu ga dai-suki de
$B$=$l$G?H>e$D$V$7$?(B
Sore de shinshou tsubushita
Mottomo da mottomo da
Ohara Shoosuke-san, why has he lo_st his fortune ?
He was fond of / sleeping la_te (in the morning), /
morning sake a_nd morning ba_th.
"Morning bath*s*"
Post by B. Ito
That$B!G(Bs why he wen_t into bankruptcy.
That$B!G(Bs rea_sonable, quite reasonable, isn$B!G(Bt it ?
2004. 7. 7, 9, 11 Translated by: B. Ito
------------------------------------------------------------
Bart
B. Ito
2004-07-11 14:36:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
...
Another min-you about which I mentioned then there is
"Aizu-Bandai-San." ...
One of the first $BL1MX(B I learned and still a favorite.
Post by B. Ito
Aizu-Bandai-San wa takara no yama yo
$B:{$K2+6b!J$3$,$M!K$,!!%(!<$^$?(B $B$J$j$5$,$k(B
Sasa ni kogane ga e- mata nari-sagaru
$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa
Ei-Ya___.
Aizu-Badai-San i_s / a_ trea_su_re mo_un_tain__.
You$B!G(Bll see the_ bamboo lea_ves / be_ari___ng re_a_l go_ld
coi__ns.
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
( Choisa___ choisa )
People might think there's bamboo involved. Would "bamboo grass" work
as well as "bamboo leaves"? And "weighed down with" fits my mental
picture better than "bearing real."
----------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you very much, Bart. I've changed to make the mental picrure better.

You$B!G(Bll see the_ bamboo grasse_s /
wei_ghed do_wn__ wi_th go_ld coin__s.

I revised my vocal sample, too.
http://bito2.tsukaeru.jp/Aizubandaisan.htm
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
(2)
$B%(%$!<%d!<(B
Ei ya-
$B$3$H$7$cK-G/!J$[$&$M$s!K!!Jf!J$[!K$KJf$,:i$$$F(B
Kotosha hounen ho ni ho ga saite
$BF;$N>.Ap!J$3$0$5!K$b!!%(!<$^$?(B $BJF$,$J$k(B
Michi no kogusa mo e- mata kome ga naru
I don't seem to have learnt this verse. My second one goes something
like $B$$$J$+(B($B!)(B)$B$6$+$G$b!"EP$l$P2<$k(B. Then somebody's name, maybe (wow,
it must be a long time since I've tried to sing this one, $B6a=j$N<jA0$r9M(B
$B$($F$M(B) before the $B%(!<$^$?(B, the $BDa%1>k(B(sp?).
Post by B. Ito
$B%A%g%$%5!<!<!<!!%A%g%$%5(B
Choisa- choisa
--------------------------------------------------------------
There sure are other verses like:

$B%(%s%d!<ED<K:d$G$b!!>e$l$P2<$k!!2qDE<7:d!!%(!<%^%?<76J$j(B

$B%(%s%d!<2qDEK_CO$N!!NP$N2F$h!!Iw$b$[$,$i$K!!%(!<%^%?Da%1>k(B

And there are still many other verses, however, I'm sorry I thought
I was not able to make good English translations out of those verses,
becuase these Japanese lyrics firstly don't make clear senses to me
due to my lack of study of their historical background.

Tomorrow I will fly from Nagoya to Akita Airport and visit several places
in Tohoku Area but sorry I have to skip Bandaisan in Fukushima Ken.
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
...
$B>.86>1=u!J$*$O$i$7$g$&$9$1$5$s!K$5$s(B $B$J$s$G?H>e!J$7$s$7$g$&!K$D$V$7$?(B
Ohara Shousuke San nande shinshou tsubushita
$BD+?2!J$"$5$M!K!!D+<r!!D+Er!J$"$5$f!K$,Bg9%$-$G(B
Asa-ne asa-zake asa-yu ga dai-suki de
$B$=$l$G?H>e$D$V$7$?(B
Sore de shinshou tsubushita
Mottomo da mottomo da
Ohara Shoosuke-san, why has he lo_st his fortune ?
He was fond of / sleeping la_te (in the morning), /
morning sake a_nd morning ba_th.
"Morning bath*s*"
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes, thanks for the *s*, too.
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
That$B!G(Bs why he wen_t into bankruptcy.
That$B!G(Bs rea_sonable, quite reasonable, isn$B!G(Bt it ?
2004. 7. 7, 9, 11 Translated by: B. Ito
------------------------------------------------------------
Bart
Ross Klatte
2004-07-12 00:33:54 UTC
Permalink
Subject: Re: "Aizu-Bandai-San"
Date: 2004-07-11 10:36 Eastern Daylight Time
Post by B. Ito
...
Another min-you about which I mentioned then there is
"Aizu-Bandai-San." ...
One of the first –¯—w I learned and still a favorite.
‰ï’Ô֒òŽRi‚ ‚¢‚Â΂ñ‚¾‚¢‚³‚ñj
Post by B. Ito
Aizu-Bandai-San wa takara no yama yo
‚Ȃ肳‚ª‚é
Post by B. Ito
Sasa ni kogane ga e- mata nari-sagaru
Choisa- choisa
Ei-Ya___.
Aizu-Badai-San i_s / a_ trea_su_re mo_un_tain__.
Youfll see the_ bamboo lea_ves / be_ari___ng re_a_l go_ld
coi__ns.
Post by B. Ito
( Choisa___ choisa )
People might think there's bamboo involved. Would "bamboo grass" work
as well as "bamboo leaves"? And "weighed down with" fits my mental
picture better than "bearing real."
----------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you very much, Bart. I've changed to make the mental picrure better.
Youfll see the_ bamboo grasse_s /
wei_ghed do_wn__ wi_th go_ld coin__s.
I revised my vocal sample, too.
http://bito2.tsukaeru.jp/Aizubandaisan.htm
Post by B. Ito
(2)
ƒGƒC[ƒ„[
Ei ya-
‚±‚Æ‚µ‚á–L”Ni‚Ù‚¤‚Ë‚ñj@•äi‚فj�
��ɕ䂪ç‚¢‚Ä
Post by B. Ito
Kotosha hounen ho ni ho ga saite
•Ä‚ª‚È‚é
Post by B. Ito
Michi no kogusa mo e- mata kome ga naru
I don't seem to have learnt this verse. My second one goes something
like ‚¢‚È‚©(H)‚´‚©‚Å‚àA“o‚ê‚Ήº‚é.
Then somebody's name, maybe (wow,
it must be a long time since I've tried to sing this one,
‹ßŠ‚ÌŽè‘O‚ðl
‚¦‚Ä‚Ë) before the ƒG[‚Ü‚½, the ’߃Pé(sp?).
Post by B. Ito
Choisa- choisa
--------------------------------------------------------------
And there are still many other verses, however, I'm sorry I thought
I was not able to make good English translations out of those verses,
becuase these Japanese lyrics firstly don't make clear senses to me
due to my lack of study of their historical background.
Tomorrow I will fly from Nagoya to Akita Airport and visit several places
in Tohoku Area but sorry I have to skip Bandaisan in Fukushima Ken.
Post by B. Ito
...
¬Œ´¯•i‚¨‚͂炵‚傤‚·‚¯‚³‚ñj�
��³‚ñ
‚È‚ñ‚Őgãi‚µ‚ñ‚µ‚傤j‚‚Ԃµ‚½
Post by B. Ito
Ohara Shousuke San nande shinshou tsubushita
’©Qi‚ ‚³‚ˁj@’©Žð@’©“’i‚ ‚³‚ä�
�j‚ª‘åD‚«‚Å
Post by B. Ito
Asa-ne asa-zake asa-yu ga dai-suki de
‚»‚ê‚Őgã‚‚Ԃµ‚½
Sore de shinshou tsubushita
Mottomo da mottomo da
Ohara Shoosuke-san, why has he lo_st his fortune ?
He was fond of / sleeping la_te (in the morning), /
morning sake a_nd morning ba_th.
"Morning bath*s*"
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes, thanks for the *s*, too.
Post by B. Ito
Thatfs why he wen_t into bankruptcy.
Thatfs rea_sonable, quite reasonable, isnft it ?
2004. 7. 7, 9, 11 Translated by: B.
Ito
Post by B. Ito
------------------------------------------------------------
Bart
I really have nothing helpful to add.

In place of Bart's "and morning baths" you could also say "and his
morning bath" or "and a morning bath."
Your original "and morning bath" is definitely wrong.
You'Íl see the bamboo grasses weighed down with gold coins
The phrase "gold coins" is quite strong--phonetically speaking--and
doesn't quite fit. I would prefer "golden coins."

I think there is a tendency for native speakers of Japanese to hope
that since "go-ru-do" is 3 morae, then "gold" must somehow be
heard as 3 syllables by native speakers of English. Such is not
the case. No matter how many different phonemes may be
involved, we *perceive* the word "gold" to be one syllable, one
mora, one indissoluble unit. Indeed, if a NSOE said to me, "In
this small leather pouch, there are three go coins" I would almost
certainly hear the word "gold."

The name "Bandai" is a little peculiar for me. It is almost familiar--
but not quite. My music teacher's teacher was "Bondai"--I don't
know if that was a name or a title. Also I think that the brand of
sake I used to enjoy vomiting was "Bandai Sake." But I can't
quite find it on the Internet. Perhaps it was "Bandei Sake."


Ross
Vontay, Virginia
http://community.webshots.com/user/ross_klatte
http://www.geocities.com/foundlingfather/
B. Ito
2004-07-16 15:44:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross Klatte
Subject: Re: "Aizu-Bandai-San"
Date: 2004-07-11 10:36 Eastern Daylight Time
Post by B. Ito
...
Another min-you about which I mentioned then there is
"Aizu-Bandai-San." ...
One of the first –¯—w I learned and still a favorite.
[...........]
Post by Ross Klatte
Post by B. Ito
Ohara Shoosuke-san, why has he lo_st his fortune ?
He was fond of / sleeping la_te (in the morning), /
morning sake a_nd morning ba_th.
"Morning bath*s*"
---------------------------------------------------------
Yes, thanks for the *s*, too.
Post by B. Ito
Thatfs why he wen_t into bankruptcy.
Thatfs rea_sonable, quite reasonable, isnft it ?
2004. 7. 7, 9, 11 Translated by: B.
Ito
Post by B. Ito
------------------------------------------------------------
Bart
I really have nothing helpful to add.
In place of Bart's "and morning baths" you could also say "and his
morning bath" or "and a morning bath."
Your original "and morning bath" is definitely wrong.
You'Íl see the bamboo grasses weighed down with gold coins
The phrase "gold coins" is quite strong--phonetically speaking--and
doesn't quite fit. I would prefer "golden coins."
I think there is a tendency for native speakers of Japanese to hope
that since "go-ru-do" is 3 morae, then "gold" must somehow be
heard as 3 syllables by native speakers of English. Such is not
the case. No matter how many different phonemes may be
involved, we *perceive* the word "gold" to be one syllable, one
mora, one indissoluble unit. Indeed, if a NSOE said to me, "In
this small leather pouch, there are three go coins" I would almost
certainly hear the word "gold."
The name "Bandai" is a little peculiar for me. It is almost familiar--
but not quite. My music teacher's teacher was "Bondai"--I don't
know if that was a name or a title. Also I think that the brand of
sake I used to enjoy vomiting was "Bandai Sake." But I can't
quite find it on the Internet. Perhaps it was "Bandei Sake."
Ross
Vontay, Virginia
http://community.webshots.com/user/ross_klatte
http://www.geocities.com/foundlingfather/
--------------------------------------------------------
Thank you very much, Ross.
I recall I realised many times that any countable noun without articles or
some other things like his/her etc. was thought ungrammatical.

I realised that "bath" is a countable noun and restudied those
grammatical things.

I take bath. wrong
I take a bath. OK
I take baths. OK
I take my bath. OK

Thanks also for pointing out the word "gold."
Most of the time "kogane" means "gold" or a "gold coin."
At another time like in this lyrics, it rather suggests "rice" in husks
which are ripen in golden color.

So this lines could be translated like, "........weighte down with rice in
golden husks.", but this may be too explanatory., and of course too
long.

The revised translations and vocal sample are in the same URL:

http://bito2.tsukaeru.jp/Aizubandaisan.htm

As to the Japanese words and pronunciations of "bandai", there are
many kanji's for it:

The pronoun for the famous mountain is "磐梯（山）." The sake you
liked very much must have been a "万代" or a　"萬代" brand.

"番台"　is quite another thing or a place, only one square-meter higher
stage for a man, oh no, usually for a woman to sit on. She takes care
of checking ins and outs of both men and women who have come to
such public baths.

I've returned from my trip to the northest Touhoku areas, Akita, Aomori
and Iwate Ken. The famous spots by their names are Oga City where
Nebuta Festival is famous, Tsugaru Kaikyou and Tappi Misaki, Lake
Towada, Osore Zan, Lake Tazawa.

Up there the weather was not so bad, but Fukushima Ken (alos Niigata
Ken) had the worst stormy weather. So I could not recognize
Aizu-Bandai-San from my airplane window either way to or fro.

-----------------------------------------------
B. Ito ***@wonder.ocn.ne.jp
日本名曲・英語ヴァージョン、全曲３1０数曲
HP: http://www8.ocn.ne.jp/~bito/　
Bart Mathias
2004-07-12 01:19:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by B. Ito
...
--------------------------------------------------------------
$B%(%s%d!<ED<K:d$G$b!!>e$l$P2<$k!!2qDE<7:d!!%(!<%^%?<76J$j(B
$B%(%s%d!<2qDEK_CO$N!!NP$N2F$h!!Iw$b$[$,$i$K!!%(!<%^%?Da%1>k(B
Yes! Those are verses I knew. I managed to get the beginning and end
mixed up.

Would you believe it? When I was young, I used to be able to memorize
one of those long verses in just an hour or two! Doesn't mean I
understood any of them.

Bart
B. Ito
2004-07-16 15:56:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bart Mathias
Post by B. Ito
...
--------------------------------------------------------------
$B%(%s%d!<ED<K:d$G$b!!>e$l$P2<$k!!2qDE<7:d!!%(!<%^%?<76J$j(B
$B%(%s%d!<2qDEK_CO$N!!NP$N2F$h!!Iw$b$[$,$i$K!!%(!<%^%?Da%1>k(B
Yes! Those are verses I knew. I managed to get the beginning and end
mixed up.
Would you believe it? When I was young, I used to be able to memorize
one of those long verses in just an hour or two! Doesn't mean I
understood any of them.
Bart
-----------------------------------------------------------------
These two lines are very difficult to understand as I said in the previous
post. It's hard for me to understand why those two verses are so meaningful
or worthwhile being included in the song.

Maybe the words "up and down" in pair and two 7's in pair mean something.
The second line is a lyrics so called "okuni-jiman" by singing up their
proudful hometwon symbol of "Tsuruga Jou."

------------------------------------------------------------
B. Ito

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